7.19.2008

Batman Begins 3: And The Villains Are...?

Warning: Spoilers if you haven't seen The Dark Knight.

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Now that Christopher Nolan has made the best Batman movie ever attempted, what's next? Another Batman movie, of course. Not only is Hollywood not going to pass on creating a sequel to what is most likely going to be one of the most groundbreaking movies of our age, but the actors are signed up for three movies, so...

But the big question is... who is going to be the next villain? Mr. Nolan has already used Ra's Al Ghul, Ducard, Falcone, and Scarecrow, and he's made the best incarnations of The Joker and Two-Face. So who will Mr. Nolan masterfully envision next? Well, let's check out a list of probabilities and the pros and cons of each. And with Christopher Nolan's apparent liking of using some lesser-known characters (Ra's Al Ghul and Scarecrow), we'll have to have quite a large selection to look at.


Name: Bane.
Information:
Incredibly strong convict most known for 'breaking' Batman... quite literally.
Pr
os: With the way the series is going, with Batman taking the fall at the end of The Dark Knight, and with Bruce Wayne's conscience playing a big role in the story, Bane's 'breaking' of Batman could turn the movie into a decent psychological movie with more time pondering the existence of Batman.
Cons:
The movie would probably be awfully boring. With Batman out of commission the entire time (or at least half the time), it would mostly be a Bruce Wayne story with very little action. It would probably be a failure, especially in comparison to The Dark Knight. Not to mention the time it would take Bruce to recuperate from the attack would be quite the time-waster on film. Also, Bane is kind of boring in comparison to other villains.
Probability:
15%


Name: Catwoman.
Information:
Anti-hero/villain with a jaded relationship with Batman.
Pros:
She's one of the more iconic roles, along with The Joker, to come from the Batman universe. And after the horrid Catwoman movie that came out a few years back, it would be great for Mr. Nolan to rub his magic on the character. Plus, Catwoman was alluded to within The Dark Knight (There's the random line about the new batsuit being able to sustain attacks from a cat). Also, there's a spot for 'love interest' open now, so Selina Kyle could easily pick up that role. And if she's in the next movie, Catwoman would make the appearance of wanting to be a kind of anti-hero that Batman has become, especially at the end of The Dark Knight (there were already 'copycats' in The Dark Knight... so yeah... get it?).
Cons:
People could still have the bad taste in their mouth from the previous Catwoman movie. Not to mention the character was done pretty darn well in Batman Returns. However, even if she is a villain in the next movie, she wouldn't be alone. Even The Joker didn't get his own movie (though, for all intents and purposes, he did).
Probability:
90%


Name: Clayface.
Information:
Think of Spider-Man's Sandman, but with clay.
Pros:
A formidable foe for Batman, and apparently a fan favorite, but otherwise not very much.
Cons:
Again... think of Spider-Man 3's Sandman. Remember how much flak that guy got for being in the movie (regardless of the awesome special effects). Also, Mr. Nolan wants to keep his movies grounded as much as possible in reality, which removes the more fantasy-type villains, such as Clayface.
Probability:
2%



Name: Harley Quinn.
Information:
Psychiatrist who becomes lover of The Joker.
Pros:
With the success of The Joker in The Dark Knight, and the capture of The Joker at the end of the movie, Dr. Harleen Quinzel would have been a good villain to portray in a similar vein to Harvey Dent (build it up until the end). There's only one little snag...
Cons:
...Because Heath Ledger died, Christopher Nolan would be an idiot to bring The Joker back in the third movie with another actor. It would be a disgrace to Heath's name and performance. I think Mr. Nolan knows this, as well. And if you're gonna have Harley, you've gotta have The Joker. Without one, you can't have the other. So in other words...
Probability:
0%


Name: Killer Croc.
Information:
Another formidable foe to Batman, Killer Croc is a man turned evil due to a mutation into a giant humanoid Crocodile.
Pros:
Like Clayface, he seems to be a fan favorite.
Cons:
Like Clayface, he's too into the realm of fantasy for Mr. Nolan.
Probability:
2%






Name: The Mad Hatter.
Information:
A man obsessed with Lewis Carroll that uses brain-control devices.
Pros:
He's a fun character, and he is grounded in reality... for the most part.
Cons: I'm afraid the machine to control the brain will be quite reminiscent of The Riddler's machine in Batman Forever. We all know how that movie went.
Probability:
10%




Name: Mr. Freeze.
Information:
In an attempt to cryogenically freeze his wife so that he had more time to search for a cure for her disease, an accident occurs which makes it so his body can't perform unless below freezing point.
Pros:
He's a fun character...
Cons:
... but after Ah-Nold, I don't think Mr. Nolan would attempt the character again. Plus... his name is Victor Fries. How lame is that. And the character really borders between science and fantasy, much like some of the aforementioned villains.
Probability:
5%


Name: The Penguin.
Information: A penguin-looking man who is a dastardly criminal and popular foe of Batman.
Pros:
As I said, he's popular. But Tim Burton really did him well the first time around. Then again, a lot of people loved Tim Burton's Joker, as well, and look what Mr. Nolan did with him. And I'm sure that in a Nolan movie, The Penguin with all his umbrella goodness would be quite awesome.
Cons:
Like I said, people liked the Burton Penguin quite a bit. And I'm not exactly sure how one of Nolan's movies would work with The Penguin.
Probability:
50%




Name: Poison Ivy.
Information:
A scientist with the ability to manipulate plants.
Pros:
Adds the sex-appeal to the movie. And like Selina Kyle, she could fill the spot of the 'love interest'.
Cons:
Again, the character borders on the fantastical instead of the realistic.
Probability:
5%







Name: The Riddler.
Information:
A criminal mastermind who leaves clues and riddles behind to challenge Batman.
Pros: A huge fan favorite, up near the top of the list. Mr. Nolan could work wonders with the character, especially after the Jim Carrey incarnation. I can totally see Nolan making the character incredibly dark and twisted, and his riddles sadistic. Even The Joker had a few Riddler-esque moments in The Dark Knight, and we all know how awesome that turned out. And, there are no fantasy aspects toward the character. And The Riddler in the next movie could play on the questions behind the importance or purpose of Batman now that he's 'on the run'.
Cons:
There really aren't many that I can think of. Well... none, actually.
Probability: 95%


Conclusion/Prediction: So, looking through all of the big villains of the Batman franchise, it is my belief that Christopher Nolan will most likely choose The Riddler and Catwoman to appear in the next film (he wouldn't do The Penguin and Catwoman, or it would be highly criticized as a ripoff of Tim Burton). So Selina Kyle would become the love interest, soon becoming Catwoman, while The Riddler begins puzzling his way to the top of the crime scene. In the end, Batman might need Catwoman's help to stop and/or figure out what's going on with The Riddler. So who would play these two new characters? There's a good casting idea for The Riddler going around that states Michael Emerson (Ben Linus from LOST). As for Catwoman... I've also heard Kate Beckinsale (and we know she looks good in black leather from the Underworld movies). What do y'all think (on everything)?

31 comments:

  1. I think that if he were to use the Riddler, he would do so in a way were we almost never see him until about half way thru the film. After seeing how tight they kept the lid on this movie, anything is possible for these guys.

    So for Catwoman... Scarlett Johannsen or Eva Mendes?

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  2. ohhh... I'd love to see Scarlett in black leather... though Eva wouldn't be bad, either.

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  3. I wouldn't mind seeing Catwoman and Riddler. (Paging Crispin Glover...)

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  4. Oh, Crispin Glover would be an awesome Riddler...

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  5. Guy Pearce as the Riddler? Nolan loves using the same actors, so that's a good possibility.

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  6. No, no, no! Crispin Glover as Riddler and Guy Peirce as Mad Hatter!

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  7. Oh yes, its not just me (a chick and hardcore comic book heroine and villainess fan) who would like Catwoman redeemed and brought to life. And yes Edward Nigma is a character that I feel fits into Nolan's dark more gritty/earthy world.

    But as for Penguin, didn't Nolan consider that character far-fetched"?

    Heres the thing, I would really love Barbara Gordon (the daughter/or niece depending) to appear. Maybe not as Batgirl, but since Gordon's there, I feel Babs should be there to give him a bit more dimension.

    Alright, I wish there were more female comic characters, its as if Hollywood just uses them for T'n'A.

    Hey, ask if anyone else went into a seizure of glee for the Watchmen trailer.

    Maybe it was just me.

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  8. Maven: I'm not sure what he said about The Penguin, but I figure he would have said that. That's why I said how The Penguin doesn't really fit into Nolan's world. On the other hand, The Riddler fits perfectly.

    Also, Barbara Gordon *was* shown in The Dark Knight... though barely. She was mentioned/alluded to when they came to tell them that Gordon was 'dead'. And then at the end in the warehouse, one of the two kids being hugged tightly by Barbara (the mother) was Barbara (the girl). So Barbara Gordon IS in the movie, she's just very young at this stage and not central to the plot.

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  9. Yes,you're right, technically she was shown, but I got the biggest feeling she was snubbed. You never saw her face, you don't hear her, you don't even really see her. She wasn't "there".

    I'm not asking for a sidekick because I really feel they wouldn't be welcome in Nolan's mind; and because I feel Gordon, Alfred, Rachel and hell, Harvey were all his "sidekicks" in a sense. But I guess I am desperately seeking some gender balance.

    (Where was Montoya? Unless Ramirez was like a quasi-doppleganger of Montoya)

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  10. I'm thinking he avoids using any of the previous franchise's villains, if possible. The Joker is a worthy exception, considering that he's probably the series (all time) most famous villain, but if I had to place bets, I'd go for one of the lesser knowns.

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  11. I would love to see The Riddler as the next villain. And, if they do it the way they did it in Dark Knight, they can have a secondary villain as well.

    I would hate for them to start teaming the villains up, like in the previous versions.

    I think the way Nolan has created these characters, that a dark and gritty Riddler would be very welcome.

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  12. Fletch: I'm not sure... the unknowns left are mostly too fantastical (and lame) for him. Not to mention, especially after The Joker, he'd lose a huge fan base by going for unknown villains. He could get away with it in Batman Begins... but he won't be able to get away with it in the sequel to the best superhero movie ever made.

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  13. Cool post!

    I did one like this last week and mentioned a character or two (or three) that you missed.

    take a peek if you like...

    http://mcneilmatinee.blogspot.com/2008/07/know-your-enemy.html

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  14. I think he will use The Riddler as the main villain, and make it as a serial killer, like the one Kevin Spacey performs on Seven. It would be great and the darker Batman movie ever.

    Batman would need to use his detective abilities more than ever, like he does in the comics, and crime could be more than robberies and drugs.

    Batman wouldn't need more help than Gordon's, Alfred's and Fox's (and Morgan's would be great, as he did on Seven) and as a side villain, we still have Two Faces, who even can help Batman a little bit at the end and redeem himself that way.

    Selina Kyle could be also on it, but not as Catwoman, only as Batman's love interest from the beginning of the movie. Selina would be the last victim of The Riddler (he will only achieve to kidnap and torture her, not kill her; this will cause Batman's rage, and he will rescue her and capture/kill The Riddler). As a result of the torture, Selina would end insane, and we will watch the beginning of her Catwoman's personality development at the end of the movie, a perfect bridge for a fourth instalment.

    Two Faces could or not die in the process.

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  15. Javier: There are two issues with your theory:

    1) Two Face is already dead. He died at the end of The Dark Knight.

    2) I'm not sure is Nolan would want to keep that huge of a cliffhanger (Catwoman rising) for a fourth installment that might not even come. There's only a contract for 3 movies.

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  16. Two Face is not dead. He will return for the third movie to destroy organized crime once and for all. Batman will be the only left to defend the criminals thus feeding into the public perception that he has gone rogue. Meanwhile, um, the Riddler shows up and does stuff.

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  17. Two face needs to be in the 3 movie if they want it to live up above and beyond tdk. For god sake joker and two face are in the top ten best villains of all time, joker#4, two face#8ish. How will any other villain meassure up? I think the only villains nolan would use are two face, riddler, and last may be black mask. Nolan has already used sorta out there villains but he's gunna stick with realistic villains

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  18. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  19. I totally agree with you in the choices for the next batman flick as you can check in my blog. I think that in the real and consistent world that the director Christopher Nolan has presented us, the only three villains that can be part of it are: The Riddler, Catwoman and the Penguin… But 3 villains in the next batman is too much and so from this three great villains I will choose the first two ones. I will consider to the roles Johny Depp as the Riddler, Angelina Jolie as Catwoman and Phillip Seymour Hoffman as the Penguin!

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  20. The Penquin isn't a possibility unless Christopher Nolen changes his mind. On IMDB search the trivia section on 'The Dark Knight' and he basically said that The Penquin is too far fetched of a character. Other than that, Great predictions, I hope you're right about The Riddler being in it.

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  21. There will be no Catwoman, or Penguin in this series, as Nolan doesn't like them. As there is an opening for a new female love interest, I think the obvious choice is going to be Talia Al Ghul, Ras Al Ghul's daughter and (in the comics) mother of Damian Bruce Wayne (obviously, Bruce's kid). There could be a great love story twisted with her being in love with Bruce and hating Batman for killing her father.

    Aside from that, Bane is very likely, but if he's going to break Batman's back, it'd be at the end. But as he is Batman's perfect enemy (in that he can equal up to Batman in any sense) he'd be great. The Riddler does seem to be likely, but considering they don't want to use any more previously used villains, I would say that the Riddler's only likely if they want to take the series more mainstream.

    Joker will not return, but probably will be referred to. And Two Face is DEAD, as Nolan has said, he wanted Harvey Dent to die, because the way they created Two Face, his story was played out already. He broke his neck in the fall. But he kept the ending semi-ambiguous, in case (after he's finished, so probably after Batman 3) another director comes along and wants to play out Two Faces story more. But he will not return in Batman 3.

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  22. IMO...The rock as bane, and Johnny Dep as the Riddler.
    This is the final film, most likely, and the Riddler simply WILL NOT carry it alone. It isnt because the riddler isnt good enough, on the contrary he's a great choice. The problem is that here has yet to be a villain besides Raz who can challenge batman’s hand to hand combat ability and bane is the only Nolan compatible character who can do that to a T. Aside from that you have the Riddler, who can challenge batman’s mind as bane challenges his strength (joker only challenged his mind an patience). If Johnny dep plays the Riddler, he can do his best to take the title of “enigmatic awesome guy” that heath ledger seems to have taken from him with his joker role. On top of that you have the rock, probably the only wrestler alive who can act (and closer to banes ethnicity than any other contender is going to get without cg). The rock not only seeks to prove himself do to how many crappy movies he’s been in (a case similar to ledgers) he can add an element of charisma to bane that would bring the character to the top villains section in Hollywood where the character belongs. If they do it any other way, I will be pretty disappointed, but interested. They made me eat crow with ledger so I hope they can do it again if they go in another direction. But seeing the rock as bane and dep as riddler would put so many butts in seats the record would be topped for sure I REALLY hope they go in this direction.

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  23. I'll go you one further. Imagine if the Riddler, knowing that bane, a foreign hired killer has batman's number, sets his crimes up not only to wreak havoc but to get batman closer to bane. Every time batman goes in to clean the Riddler’s mess, he has to face bane and every time he does he nearly escapes with his life,
    The ultimate question (something the Riddler is sure to ponder) would be, just how far will batman go when he cant win, and Gorham will fall anyway when he loses?)
    this is different from TKN, because there really wasnt a doubt in batman's mind that he was going to beat the Joker, it was only a matter of how many bodies would be left in the wake before he could get to his nemesis. In this scenario, the more batman pushes, the more Gotham's only protector is at risk.

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  24. NO! Seth Green as Riddler and Seymour As Penguin Fighting against each other, while two face is orchastrating them both and poisan ivy is Two-faces secret lover but is also batmans lover and Two face now has two reasons to kill batman because he's paranoid that batman's trying to take his girl and bane wants to kill them both because secretly he has a crush on poisan ivy

    Get real guys, they aren't gonna put catwoman, bane or probably the penguin in and they're definantly not gonna put Freeze, Mad Hatter, Poisan ivy, and MUDMAN in it

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